Rescue pumps

    Would you like a Rescue Pump cross over vehicle in game? 37

    1. Yes (31) 84%
    2. No (4) 11%
    3. Im not sure (2) 5%

    I was looking at reverting to a fully realistic set up of units in my home county of Suffolk in the uk when i realised that they have no true Heavy Rescues, They have something called Enhanced Pump Rescue Tenders or Pump Rescue Tender but these are also what would be considered a TYPE 1 in mission chief and to make these into heavy rescues would mean me taking 13 Type 1's off duty and replacing them with Heavy Rescues, In some of my other counties this would be an even greater number. So i was thinking it would be nice to see a Rescue pump crossover vehicle that serves as both a type 1 and a heavy rescue.


    This unit would require you to be of the level of Captain and once you have reached that level it would be 19K Credits, If you wanted to purchase one before that level it would be 25 Coins (this is the same as the Quint). I know this game is mainly based on US fire services but i think i have heard of equivalent units in the US.


    I have added a poll to see how popular these units would be.


    Here are two pictures, one of a British rescue pump and one of an american rescue pump.

    I'm sorry but I just have to speak my mind here. This adds nothing to the game and doesn't even work with what the game is trying to be. Rescues are underused yes but is your heavy rescue going to be first in on a house fire, pull a line, and start fire attack? Like come on. Think logical here. Heavy rescues are used for technical rescue situations where specific equipment is needed. (I.E. Shoring, cribbing, extrication, dive, and hazardous materials some times) If you really want a rescue pumper just simply rename your rescue or your engine.

    Quote from Volley

    I'm sorry but I just have to speak my mind here. This adds nothing to the game and doesn't even work with what the game is trying to be. Rescues are underused yes but is your heavy rescue going to be first in on a house fire, pull a line, and start fire attack? Like come on. Think logical here. Heavy rescues are used for technical rescue situations where specific equipment is needed. (I.E. Shoring, cribbing, extrication, dive, and hazardous materials some times) If you really want a rescue pumper just simply rename your rescue or your engine.

    Your missing my point, when you are playing in an area that has 0 Heavy rescues this can make or break your setup, To remove the type 1 and put a Heavy Rescue would mean a type 1 would have to come from 15 miles away, If there was no need for them then why do they exist, the reason they exist is because not every Brigade/Station/Department has the space and/or money to have dedicated Heavy Rescue units. Unfortunately some rural areas have no funds to have a full blown USAR/Heavy Rescue division and they have to improvise, I wish they did have and in an ideal world they would have, but this is not an ideal world.


    Can I ask you to think logically here, how would adding one of these units for the players who DONT have any heavy rescues in there area affect the game for you or interfere in your setup, it wouldn't, if casual players want to spend money on coins or credits on this vehicle then that's there choice, but it wouldn't ruin the game, those people already probably have a non realistic setup already, and for the players playing realisticly they can either make there set up more realistic if they have these types of units and if they don't have these types of units then they can just simply not buy them as it would be classed as a new separate vehicle for calls.

    Quote from Volley

    I'm sorry but I just have to speak my mind here. This adds nothing to the game and doesn't even work with what the game is trying to be. Rescues are underused yes but is your heavy rescue going to be first in on a house fire, pull a line, and start fire attack? Like come on. Think logical here. Heavy rescues are used for technical rescue situations where specific equipment is needed. (I.E. Shoring, cribbing, extrication, dive, and hazardous materials some times) If you really want a rescue pumper just simply rename your rescue or your engine.

    How can you say these units don't make sense when a lot of the world use them, obviously they must be making some sense, I know my local department uses them as we don't have Heavy rescues, Not all of us are players from major cities you know.

    You do realize that by creating a rescue pumper that gets rid of the need for both units? But yet you want to just keep creating more. As well I understand departments actually use those units, but by saying oh I want this unit because my small department has it is basically saying that the game is to be tailored to you. If this is seriously what you guys want as the top priority for this game then go play the german version. They have five different types of engines and I'm damn well sure that one of them is a rescue pumper. Right now we don't have much for our version simply because we flood the dev with these stupid ideas that are nonsense right now. Plain and simple.

    Quote from Volley

    You do realize that by creating a rescue pumper that gets rid of the need for both units? But yet you want to just keep creating more. As well I understand departments actually use those units, but by saying oh I want this unit because my small department has it is basically saying that the game is to be tailored to you. If this is seriously what you guys want as the top priority for this game then go play the german version. They have five different types of engines and I'm damn well sure that one of them is a rescue pumper. Right now we don't have much for our version simply because we flood the dev with these stupid ideas that are nonsense right now. Plain and simple.

    So what about the quint?, Do the ladder and type 1 serve no purpose anymore? The answer is no because of the level restrictions on the unit, a lot of North American players wanted a Quint which could have had the exact same reason for not having one as what you are giving to this but no it went ahead and is now in the game, Quints are rarely used outside of North America so I could argue that the Quint was "Tailored" for North American players.


    By saying that I should go and play the German version is ridiculous, are you saying that if your local fire department/ EMS Service/ police service doesn't operate the same as a North American department than they are not welcome on this game? Unfortunately there is only 1 English version of this game and this is it and whether you like it or not people from outside of the United States will have different opinions, different units and will want to post suggestions about it.


    I would agree with what you are saying about it being "Tailored" for me if it was just my local area but it's not, the Majority of the UK have these types of vehicles aswell as countries such as Australia, New Zealand, Norway just to name a few, let alone the US and Canadian departments that use them also.


    I think think that the developer should be commended on working on this game in is spare time however I think it's time that players from outside of the US got something they asked for, I have dealt with a mainly US based game to a while now, I have over 55 million earned credits and then i suggest one thing for players outside the US (and some inside the US) and you come along, tell me it's pointless and then tell me to go play the German version of the game.

    I believe a unit like this would not be a bad idea. I disagree with Volley, it is a realistic unit used in many parts of the world and therefore, is a nice suggestion to the game. I do not believe it would unbalance it either as it requires a high level and a large amount of credits, basically it only furthers the realism of the game.

    The rescue pumper suggestion wouldn't be a bad suggestion if this version of the game wasn't primarily based off of U.S. style units. From what I can tell in game, all of the units have a US based feel. It would be pretty odd to see a European/different part of the world based rig. Some US departments may use Rescue Pumpers but tend to use them as an engine still. They don't replace the heavy rescue aspect for a department. For the point of smaller towns in particular that don't have that type of vehicle, mutual aid/automatic aid would be utilized for that.


    For quints, they're used for departments that don't need to buy a 100 foot or 100 foot plus ladder to fight fires. Additionally, it is utilized for departments to save money while having a rig that can pump as well as have a 75 foot ladder on the top. Yes it may be a "US Based" unit, but that's what the game is based off of. Correct me if I'm wrong, but a majority of the units that UK/rest of the world utilize are similar to the German version. It doesn't seem to make sense of creating a unit that isn't utilized in the country the game is technically based off of. Asking for something along the lines of a water rescue vehicle, more in-depth PD units, MCI, or maybe a more useful solution to the EMS fly-car would be the best way to go in my opinion.

    Quote from BSOFR12

    The rescue pumper suggestion wouldn't be a bad suggestion if this version of the game wasn't primarily based off of U.S. style units. From what I can tell in game, all of the units have a US based feel. It would be pretty odd to see a European/different part of the world based rig. Some US departments may use Rescue Pumpers but tend to use them as an engine still. They don't replace the heavy rescue aspect for a department. For the point of smaller towns in particular that don't have that type of vehicle, mutual aid/automatic aid would be utilized for that.


    For quints, they're used for departments that don't need to buy a 100 foot or 100 foot plus ladder to fight fires. Additionally, it is utilized for departments to save money while having a rig that can pump as well as have a 75 foot ladder on the top. Yes it may be a "US Based" unit, but that's what the game is based off of. Correct me if I'm wrong, but a majority of the units that UK/rest of the world utilize are similar to the German version. It doesn't seem to make sense of creating a unit that isn't utilized in the country the game is technically based off of. Asking for something along the lines of a water rescue vehicle, more in-depth PD units, MCI, or maybe a more useful solution to the EMS fly-car would be the best way to go in my opinion.

    I understand where you are coming from, this version is primarily played by people from the US and from a business sense you target your primary market, I get that I myself are in business. All I ask is that players from outside of the US get a little bit more recognition, that's another good thing with this unit, it's not unheard of in the US so it would be out of place.


    In regards to when you said about German and UK services being similar I would say the UK is in between both.

    I'm going to put my two cents in here.


    Rescue engines are used by a ton of US departments around here because it is a lot easier to fit a little bit of rescue into an engine than to purchase a tandem axle/dedicated rescue truck that may only see several wrecks per year, let alone a technical rescue. Rescue engines around my area normally carry hydraulic tools and cribbing, as well as struts, and airbags. The essentials for vehicle wrecks. They may have some technical rescue equipment, but the main idea is that the crew is trained in performing these tasks. If there is a rank requirement on a rescue-pumper I cannot see it causing any issues in the game. Maybe we could have it unlocked at Staff Captain and require a training course. I don't know, but I don't want to rule it out.

    Quote from Aether

    I'm going to put my two cents in here.


    Rescue engines are used by a ton of US departments around here because it is a lot easier to fit a little bit of rescue into an engine than to purchase a tandem axle/dedicated rescue truck that may only see several wrecks per year, let alone a technical rescue. Rescue engines around my area normally carry hydraulic tools and cribbing, as well as struts, and airbags. The essentials for vehicle wrecks. They may have some technical rescue equipment, but the main idea is that the crew is trained in performing these tasks. If there is a rank requirement on a rescue-pumper I cannot see it causing any issues in the game. Maybe we could have it unlocked at Staff Captain and require a training course. I don't know, but I don't want to rule it out.

    Okay. Every engine within the county I worked for had cribbing and hydraulic tools. So does that mean we all used rescue engines? I mean space for those and the set up for those are common coming from the manufacturer

    Yeah all of the aforementioned tools tend to already be on engines/ladders throughout the country. It doesn't have to be a rescue engine to be able to handle MVA's. The Technical Rescue Team or Heavy Rescues are where you start getting into more in-depth tools and equipment that is used for more than just vehicle accidents. They have gear that is utilized for Trench Rescue, Confined space Rescue, collapse rescue, rope rescue and VMR extrication. Some teams even have gear for swift water rescue or ice rescue depending on where you live. There tends to be a reason why an engine and/or ladder can handle MVA"s without having to have a Heavy Rescue/TRT team responding every time.

    Ok a quint is something that a lot of place will use in place of a full size ladder in places that have no need for a 100ft or larger ladder. Most quints are normally 75ft yes there are places that run 100ft+ quints but they are normally smaller ladders that also have to ability to act as an engine making them multi purpose.These are great for smaller departments that may not have space or money for two different units or have to call volume to support having two different full sized trucks. As for a rescue pumper it is normally used a small engine with a smaller tank and pump that carries a small amount extra equipment. A rescue truck on the other had has all of the necessary equipment to any type of major rescue call (building collapses and tactical rescues). There is no way that a smaller rescue pumper is going to be able to handle a large incident like that they would not carry near as much equipment as needed for most rescues. Most places an engine will carry most of the same stuff as this Rescue pumper you want. And as for the the UK I feel like they are a lot more like German style trucks and how they operate. The US doesn't operate in the same way as the UK. Also just because I have almost 70 million credits earned does that mean that everything I suggest should automatically be put in this game and that the game should be tailored to me personally, NO the amount of credits you have earned has nothing to do with the need for a unit in this game. Just because you happen to have spent more time or money in this game doesn't at all mean that you automatically should have everything you want added or changed in the game. If that was the case I would have already made sure that we got things added like Water Rescue, K9, and would have made sure that that little useless fly car would finally be able to spreed his wings and soar.

    I would just like to add another real-life POV. I moved from the city of Grandville Michigan, to West St. Louis County, Missouri. In Grandville we have three engines, but one is a combination Rescue/Engine. (Engines 51 and 52, and Rescue 53). Now for a long time, R-53 was only a rescue with no firefighting equipment. In addition, it was the only unit that had extrication tools. In the event of an MVA with Entrapment and Fire our units on scene would be Car-1 (Chief), Medic-58 (Non-Transport EMT SUV), Engine 51 (for fire extinguishment) and Rescue 53 (for extrication). Engine 51 didn't have any rescue equipment and only served as fire protection. This left 4 units on scene, and a large strain on our small-town paid-on-call department. Now we have the three engines, one with rescue capability, and are able to cut back on units on scene, and personnel/response time and costs. Rescue 53 (the combination unit) substitutes for two units and uses 4-6 personnel on scene instead of 6-10 for two large units by conducting both extrication and extinguishment. Here in St. Louis I've seen the same things. Departments here almost all operate combination engines (Engine/Rescue OR Quint/Rescue) and all carry extrication equipment. Meanwhile, an MVA with entrapment only requires one combo engine, and ambulance, in West County there are only two dedicated heavy rescues, and for the most part they are ONLY used in special operations incidents and never MVAs (although one is used occasionally for medical responses) I've added several pictures to illustrate. Pardon their random order.


    Former Rescue 53 (Now Crockery Township Rescue 572)
    board.missionchief.com/index.php?attachment/403/
    Grandville Engine 52 (Engine 51's similar older brother)
    board.missionchief.com/index.php?attachment/404/
    Grandville Car 1 (Just in case you're interested)
    board.missionchief.com/index.php?attachment/408/
    An example of a combination Rescue/Engine in St. Louis County (Des Peres E/R-2814)
    board.missionchief.com/index.php?attachment/410/
    Another St. Louis combination example (Metro West FPD E/R-3344)
    board.missionchief.com/index.php?attachment/411/
    Grandville Medic 58 (Again, in case you're interested)
    board.missionchief.com/index.php?attachment/413/
    Metro West FPD Heavy Rescue-3346 (No firefighting capabilities, but never runs MVA calls)
    board.missionchief.com/index.php?attachment/414/
    Grandville E-51 (No rescue capability)

    Grandville Fire Department combination R/E-53
    board.missionchief.com/index.php?attachment/407/

    Quote from Mouserc444

    Ok a quint is something that a lot of place will use in place of a full size ladder in places that have no need for a 100ft or larger ladder. Most quints are normally 75ft yes there are places that run 100ft+ quints but they are normally smaller ladders that also have to ability to act as an engine making them multi purpose.These are great for smaller departments that may not have space or money for two different units or have to call volume to support having two different full sized trucks. As for a rescue pumper it is normally used a small engine with a smaller tank and pump that carries a small amount extra equipment. A rescue truck on the other had has all of the necessary equipment to any type of major rescue call (building collapses and tactical rescues). There is no way that a smaller rescue pumper is going to be able to handle a large incident like that they would not carry near as much equipment as needed for most rescues. Most places an engine will carry most of the same stuff as this Rescue pumper you want. And as for the the UK I feel like they are a lot more like German style trucks and how they operate. The US doesn't operate in the same way as the UK. Also just because I have almost 70 million credits earned does that mean that everything I suggest should automatically be put in this game and that the game should be tailored to me personally, NO the amount of credits you have earned has nothing to do with the need for a unit in this game. Just because you happen to have spent more time or money in this game doesn't at all mean that you automatically should have everything you want added or changed in the game. If that was the case I would have already made sure that we got things added like Water Rescue, K9, and would have made sure that that little useless fly car would finally be able to spreed his wings and soar.

    When I said about the credits I meant it in away such as that It's not as if I just got the game yesterday and want it to be changed fully from US, I have played the game for a while so I do apologise for that.


    I understand what you are saying about that the units carry less equipment, If I was to get a building collapse or something of that nature then I would send heavy Rescue as you could not speak with an incident like that with a Rescue Pump but for jobs such as "Dangerous Goods Truck Accidents" A Rescue Pump would suffice.

    I'm just trying to understand the practicality of this unit in the game. For road accidents, a single engine is able to handle the call. For the building collapses, heavy rescues make sense. Is it more of wanting a cheaper option to buying a heavy rescue which isn't that pricey to begin with? A dangerous goods accident would be more of a hazmat team need than the need of having a rescue engine on scene due to the fact of the unknown/known materials of the cargo.

    Quote from TACRfan

    When I said about the credits I meant it in away such as that It's not as if I just got the game yesterday and want it to be changed fully from US, I have played the game for a while so I do apologise for that.
    I understand what you are saying about that the units carry less equipment, If I was to get a building collapse or something of that nature then I would send heavy Rescue as you could not speak with an incident like that with a Rescue Pump but for jobs such as "Dangerous Goods Truck Accidents" A Rescue Pump would suffice.

    I am not sure what a rescue pumper would do on a call like this that a regular engine would not be able to handle. Also for a call of this nature I would think that the hazmat or heavy rescue team would be used to handle something of this nature due to the unknown factor.

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